Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: I was always competitive, to be honest, but I was very lucky because I was competitive. I was, I was the worst of the competitive group in my age group.
And there were eight girls from Alberta at that time. And six out of the eight either went on to compete at the Olympic level or world championship level, represent Team Canada internationally, or medal at the Olympics. And so, I mean that was a gift in and of itself because being the worst out of kind of that group of girls, they pushed me, but they also pulled me along. You know, kind of that cliche of like you become the, you become like the people that you spend the most time around. I was very lucky that they continued to beat me. And from an early age it really like showed me or told taught me that there's a fundamental difference between being beat and losing.
[00:01:02] Speaker B: That was a clip from today's guest. Today is an interesting episode. It is like a real meeting point between two different parts of my life. It is someone who knows my family in a real interesting way and we'll save that. And also someone who has just this incredible story of taking risks, perseverance, really impressive career in one arena that they're able to parlay into another. Just a really cool story and also has to do with my hometown. So all of it kind of, it lights up all the boxes for me. I'm really stoked. And before we get to it, please rate Review subscribe to the podcast My name is Aram Arslanian and this is one step beyond.
Welcome to the show.
[00:02:03] Speaker A: Thank you for having me, Aram. I'm so grateful to be here. This is going to be a blast.
[00:02:08] Speaker B: Heck yeah. All right, so for the uninitiated, for those who don't know who are you and what do you do?
[00:02:14] Speaker A: My name is Anastasia Busis.
I am a two time long track speed skater that competed in Vancouver 2010 and Sochi 2014 and now I am a sports sports host with CBC. So I get to host the Olympic Games and I'm happy as a clam always.
[00:02:30] Speaker B: That is awesome. All right, let's start with just kind of our mutual connection point.
You grew up in Calgary and my mom was your teacher, is that right?
[00:02:41] Speaker A: Yeah, that's how we, that's how we've met. Like I truly slid into, I think your DM being like is your mother Ursula Arslanian because she was the best teacher I've ever had. And truly, I mean she taught me grade seven through grade nine at St. Augustine School in Calgary and she just made everyone feel so special and empowered and like I just, it was so unique and it was such a awkward time of life. I mean, I don't know if anyone peaks in grade seven, but your mom made me feel like I could accomplish anything in my life. And I'll never forget that. You know, you forget what people say or what they do, but you'll never forget how they made, you know, you, you feel. And yeah, I'm a big fan of your moms. So thanks for having me on the pod.
[00:03:26] Speaker B: Oh, no, thank you.
So being someone who grew up in sport, you'll, you, I would believe, understand the value of mentorship, coaching, having a strong teacher in your life, all those. So reflecting back on that, what did you get out of being involved in things where you had strong figures that you could like, really rely on for guidance?
[00:03:50] Speaker A: Well, I was very lucky because when I was speed skating, I started when I was four years old. You know, I remember watching the 1994 Lillenhammer Olympics and going, that's what I want to do.
I grew up at a time with some just amazing female role models. Susan Auk, Katrina Lemay Doan, Clara Hughes, Cindy Clausen, Christina Groves, you know, all of these individuals, aside from Susan and Katrina, they're a little bit older than I am. They became teammates and friends. And to have just such independent, kick ass, like grounded, strong, confident role models that I could see and touch and smell and be so close to their success is. It's been the greatest gift. I mean, it's been a gift that's kept on giving. And I think sometimes people think of sport and they go, okay, team sport versus individual sport. And speed skating has given me the gift also of being an individual sport that's so difficult that you need to learn how to train and work with a team around you. So you kind of get the best of both worlds a little bit. And it's really made me the person that I am today. I mean, wins, losses, of course you lose or you learn so much more from, from the losses. But it gave me a really lovely foundation to meet every challenge head on now in my second career, so I'm so grateful for speed skating.
[00:05:21] Speaker B: So in your second career, have you found coaches or mentors, people that have guided you along the path?
[00:05:27] Speaker A: I have. And yeah, I was just talking to my wife about it because I was like, who do I gravitate towards? And it's been very similar throughout my entire life, I would say. I mean, there's different times and different people, people that come into it to teach you a lesson or to help you But I, I really gravitate towards leaders that don't need to kind of show you that they're the leader.
I, I really appreciate that kind of quiet, calm confidence and anyone that really meets me where I'm at too, and, and like, has a really humanistic kind of lens on problems. I, I gravitate towards that energy real, really, really quickly because, yeah, in sport, I think it's so fleeting. Success can be so up and down. And to me, that's really shown me that you have to define success on your own terms as well, because sometimes you're the, you're the fastest skater and then some days you were 12th and no one wants to say your name right. So, yeah, really gravitating towards people that I think also can define success without the outcomes quite yet. That's. Those are the, those are the people that have helped me the most.
[00:06:39] Speaker B: So what about in your life? How have you been a coach or mentor for other people? And, like, what approach do you take to it?
[00:06:49] Speaker A: Great question. I, you know what? Like, I think so many people, I can advocate for anyone. I cannot advocate for myself. That is definitely. I still struggle with that one.
But I always, like, I always believe and I always have believed that making people feel, you know, seen and appreciated very much like your mom, like how I said she made me feel special. Like, that's someone that truly, you know, has shown me that lesson is the power of making someone feel special and that they can do something or that we all have that thing inside of us that makes us great.
I try and lean into positive. Like, I try and be overly positive. Not toxic positivity, but I guess just a privilege too, of growing up in elite sport. Like, yeah, I've been surrounded by people the great majority of my life that have shown up and have had clear, concise goals. And I know that they're trying their best. Like, I do believe that people try their best mostly when they're, when they're showing up. So does that give you, like, a lovely, concise answer as to what kind of leader I am? Probably not. But those are some of the guiding kind of north stars that I've tried to center myself around.
[00:08:05] Speaker B: Heck yeah. Let's go back to speed skating in the start. So before speed skating, before you saw it on tv, did your family already have a background in sports? So were there athletes already in your family?
[00:08:18] Speaker A: Yeah, I think my parents weren't. They weren't born with two left feet, but, you know, my dad liked playing football. He wanted to play in college, but but the, the tie with speed skating was super random. I think truly just growing up in Calgary, they knew that we had the best facilities in the world. I was born in 89 and we hosted 88, of course, but I, when I watched Lillenhammer, it was actually figure skating. That spy inspired the dream. Like Oksana Bayoul, she swoops in, it's Nancy Kerrigan, Tanya Harding battling it out like this larger than life narrative.
And it was Oxana Bayoul's gold medal. I don't know why, I don't know. In my four year old brain, that was just what I wanted to do. And my parents kind of were like, okay, sweetie, but you'll learn to skate on speed skates. And I didn't push back.
And I was lucky. I never quit. And yeah, about 15 years later, I found myself on the starting line of the Olympic Games in Vancouver.
[00:09:15] Speaker B: So when did it go from like, oh yeah, like this is just like my activity, my kids activity, to being like, oh no, this is like a thing.
[00:09:24] Speaker A: I was always competitive, to be honest, but I was very lucky because I was competitive. I was, I was the worst of the competitive group in my age group.
And there were eight girls from Alberta at that time. And six out of the eight either went on to compete at the Olympic level or World championship level, represent Team Canada internationally, or medal at the Olympics.
And so, I mean, that was a gift in and of itself because being the worst out of kind of that group of girls, they pushed me, but they also pulled me along. Um, you know, kind of that cliche of like you become the, the, you become like the people that you spend the most time around. I was very lucky that they continued to beat me. And from an early age it really like showed me or taught me that there's a fundamental difference between being beat and losing. Because I would lose to all those, you know, the other seven girls. I'd be eight out of eight, but I would be eighth in North America. Perhaps. I'm making up these numbers just a tad, so please bear with me.
But, but I was always in a competitive field. It just forced me to really be honest and provide significant feedback to myself. Like, what am I doing when I'm skating well, what am I doing when I'm happy on and off the ice? You know, like, it was just a real feedback of what's in my control. How can I execute what's in my control or identify what's in my control? And then when that gun goes off, okay, I might be eighth out of eighth. But then I might be six out of eight, and then I might be fifth out of eighth, but I'm right there. And then I have a little bit of a metal shot. Xyz. It was real incremental lessons, and it. It just. Yeah, I can't believe. I can't believe it's over. Sometimes I'm like, I've been retired for seven years, and here I am still talking about speed skating outdoors in Red Deer, Alberta. But it truly has, like, laid the foundation of my Life.
[00:11:33] Speaker B: Yeah, totally. 100%. I grew up playing in bands ever since I was a little kid. Like, my mom was very cool that she allowed me and my friends to play terrible music in their basement for hours on end. And that was all I did, really focus on it. Well, I went to school and did all that, but I played as much as you can in the kind of music that I play, and I played a professional level, and that's in. In, like, the tail lights for me. Like, I still kind of do it recreationally, but it is, like, how I do what I do now. And it's like I parlayed that into something else. And it's like this foundational thing that.
[00:12:12] Speaker A: What are your thoughts on the TikTok music scene? That's, like, the conversation I'm so interested in. It's changing the game.
[00:12:18] Speaker B: I barely even know what TikTok is. Like, my, like, Monica has a TikTok, and we use one for the. For the podcast. But, like, I don't even have an Instagram. I. I have an Instagram, but I don't run it. It's just, like, only for the podcast. So, like, I got no comment. All right. I want to ask you a question, though, that I'm real interested in competition. So were you. You said I was a competitive person. Were you a naturally competitive person? Or is it, like, a learned thing, or is it maybe a bit of A and B?
[00:12:47] Speaker A: I think I was a naturally competitive person. And I only say that because now that I'm 35 and I'm surrounded by, you know, kids that are perhaps getting into. And I. I see how they interact with the sport. Like, I was an intense little kid. I'm like, oh, my. You know, I, I, yeah, I. I definitely liked racing, and I've always been a racer since I was 4 or 5 years old to, you know, when I retired at 27.
Didn't love training that much, to be honest. I could get through it. Don't get me wrong. I always tried hard. I worked very, very hard. But There was like a sixth little gear on race day. And even now when I am, you know, in the field or the mix zone for, for CBC Sports or, you know, at the Olympics, I still feel it very viscerally. And I, I am not, I trust me, I've got lots of frailties and I'm, I'm not perfect, but I'm, I can almost see like when someone is going to have a good one versus not just by, by body language, by how they're holding themselves, by the energy. I'm quite an empath. And it, it's nice. It's like a little blast from the past because I'm like, oh no, I am a racer. It is ingrained. I do think, though, to your question about A or B, I think it would be a little bit more lovely if perhaps I was more in the middle of that too, because I always had something a little extra when I needed it, which is a really lovely thing to have. Uh, but I wish I could have had more consistency in the training races or the races that didn't matter as much. Um, because, you know, consistency then can help you get to those extra levels. And sometimes I would struggle almost to like get up to perform if it doesn't matter as much.
[00:14:38] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
So specific to, about being competitive. We live in an interesting time where like you speak to one person about being competitive, they'll speak about it in a very like, what a great thing. It's such a gift to be competitive. It was the thing that gave me the edge. And you speak to someone else, you'll be like, ugh, that person's so competitive and it's kind of toxic.
What's the difference between like a healthy competitiveness that like lifts you and other people up versus toxic competitiveness?
[00:15:06] Speaker A: It's a great question and it is subtle too. It is subtle because I had teammates that were so good and you could tell that they're competitive. Edge lifted us all. And then you'd have a teammate where you're like, oh my God, you're not seeing the forest through the trees. You know what I mean? Like, no one's gonna win an Olympic gold medal in warm up. Like, stop it. Like, we're here.
It's true though, you know, you love your teammates, but then you have to go to the line and compete against them for a spot to represent your country. Like it's, it, it's such a privileged life. But it could be stressful, you know, being an athlete, especially in a sport like speed skating where one and done and you can win or lose by 1 1000th of a second.
I always felt like the people that were the, were the best type of competitive were the ones that knew when to say, hey, we're taking a step back and you could. They can be vulnerable. I think it also has, like, sometimes a maturity of, you know, are they focusing on the things that are in their control? Because if they're not, like, that's, that's, that's truly not helping them, it's not helping me, it's not helping this person over, over there. Um, so I think the little bit the older I get, the more those people unfortunately. Kind of. Well, not unfortunately, but we're almost weeded out because it inherently is a tendency or a character trait that, that is not conducive to performance. Sometimes when you're, when you're trying to be way too competitive and you're, you're just focusing on all the things that are outside of your control, it's very hard for that person to, to make it to a certain level, at least in sport. I mean, I'm sure there's outliers there.
I always just tried to treat people the way I wanted to be treated. You know, like, I was the rookie that was being chased before Vancouver from some veterans, and you know, in the, the latter years of my career, I was the veteran being chased by rookies. And I just always wanted to win or lose, give someone a big hug and really remind myself that the only person I am competing against is myself.
But it's easier said than done. I mean, everyone wants to win the race.
[00:17:22] Speaker B: I'm hyper competitive.
But I've tried.
I don't know. Tried is maybe I've learned through like both good things and then like bad. Bad experiences like that were also like, of my own creation of really just being like.
I've embraced being competitive. I used to deny it a lot. I'm like, oh, I'm not competitive. You know, I'm not like that. Because I viewed it, for whatever reason, I had this like, really negative view of it. I grew up like, as skateboarding and stuff like that. And so it was very like individual, just do it yourself. I wasn't very good at skateboarding, so it wasn't like I could compete with people on it. But as I got older and I started, there were certain things I could excel at. I realized I was, I started to come to terms with. I was very competitive and most of it was healthy until it wasn't healthy, but I didn't know how to Get a hold of the unhealthy side of it. Because that unhealthy side of it was about like, trying to rewrite my personal history or fill up like a hole inside of myself that was like, could never be filled. All those types of things. And I don't know if I could have gotten a hold of it quicker or not. But I would say, like, life, Life got me there eventually. Where I can be hyper competitive, but in mostly a healthy way.
[00:18:34] Speaker A: Can you play Monopoly?
[00:18:36] Speaker B: Yeah, I could. I could play Monopoly, but if we get to like, if we're playing it over multiple games or multiple days, it's going to bring out a streak in me.
[00:18:44] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah. It's so funny though, because I resonate with so much of what you've just said. Like, that healthy competition with yourself, with others. But now that I'm like, out of speed skating, I don't care at all, like, about my, like, I just, I can't get competitive because I'm like, what are you talking about? Like, I'm happy. I'm more than enough. Like, I'm going to work tomorrow. Like, I'm not, I'm not, you know, I'm not going to be the one that's freaking out about spike ball or something over a beer. I can't get there. And nor can my wife. And she was a professional soccer player, of course.
But there is. That's like such a fascinating conversation. Yeah. The healthy competitive edge versus not. Because I, I too have had experiences where you go, why did I choke so bad? Or how did I find myself in this, you know, burnout? And it's, yeah, it's, you know, trying to fill a void that cannot be filled with something external. 100%. I had to learn that lesson over and over and over again, especially when I was in the closet. You know, I really thought that speed skating could, could give me something that would fill that, that void or that loneliness. And it just wasn't the case.
[00:19:57] Speaker B: Yeah. And I'd love to, to start touching a base or touch on that in a second. I want to share with you. Kind of a funny come to terms with being the person that sucks the most at something story.
[00:20:09] Speaker A: Okay.
[00:20:12] Speaker B: So, like, I'm totally comfortable at sucking at stuff. It's like, it's no, it's no big deal math.
But I, I can say that I've really gotten there. We went, we took our, we went out to Tofina last summer. We go, we go every summer, but this is the first time we went surfing as a family. And our 6 year old was just like, boom. She's hopping up on the surfboard, crushing it, just doing it over and over. Like, like really good. Like, unbelievable. Our oldest daughter, she gets up and does like about like nine or ten really good rides. And I'm just eating it like over and over. And for me, it's not about doing better than them. I just didn't want to be the only person who totally blew it and didn't hit anything. And finally I got up and did like two runs in after like two days.
[00:21:00] Speaker A: Good for you though. I was like Tofino first and foremost. The water is so cold, it's so beautiful. But like, you can't be a wimp surfing Tofino. So I'm, I'm giving you all the love. I'm giving you all the love. Thank you. Thank you.
[00:21:13] Speaker B: I couldn't believe it though. Our 6 year old was like crushing it, crushing it. She's like, oh, surfing's easy. How dare you.
[00:21:20] Speaker A: I know, I know. Children, like, it's like they just. No fear or something. Yeah, it's amazing.
[00:21:28] Speaker B: All right, so let's go to your story of like coming, coming out and also like how you've used your platform in that regard because it was really like super inspiring, super interesting time that, that you were in as you did that. So whatever you're comfortable sharing with that.
[00:21:47] Speaker A: Of course.
Yeah. And it's, it's so funny because I'm, I need to name drop your mom again. Like Mrs. Arslanian. Your mother, Ursula, my teacher in junior high, she was such a faith based woman and like, just, just, I, I, I don't know, it was never even like religion with a capital R. Just how she treated people and how she maneuvered the world was such a, yeah, just an inspiration. Like, I really felt like she was, well, she is, excuse me, a lovely human being that really, again, cemented, you know, treating people the way you want to be treated and all these things.
And growing up in a Catholic household, very Roman Catholic, Catholic school to grade 12, it was tough. Like, it was really, really, really, really tough to even get to a place where I could kind of have that conversation with myself because I had just gone head first into speed skating and I knew that something was lacking and we had touched on that kind of void. But I kept going. Nope. Like, if I qualify for the Olympic Games and I can say that this is my goal and a check mark and I'm an Olympian, all of that'll go away. Like, I was still naive enough to think you know, Olympians don't have problems. Like what, what, what problem does Katrina LeMay Doan have? Like she's a human being with, with a, you know, like I was just so, so ne that I had tunnel vision into, into that goal of going to Vancouver 2010. And I would say I qualified for that Olympics on December 27, 2009 at about 3:10pm in the afternoon in the Calgary Olympic Oval. And it was a dream come true, truly. I mean I got to do that in front of family and friends and to compete in a home Olympic Games is one of the most special.
I can't even find the words, like truly. It sounds cliched, but to, to wear the maple leaf at home at the Olympics was unbelievable.
But I quickly realized that that wasn't actually going to cure any of this void inside of me and that external rewards or results were not going to change any of like the, the toxic lack of self love I had because I didn't know how to reconcile, you know, the faith that I was brought up in a conservative city where, you know, when, when we were there, to my understanding there wasn't much queer culture and I just had no representation. Like at that point it was like Rosie O'Donnell, like, okay, she lives in New York and is a comedian. What does this have to do with my life? Like, I felt like an alien. And I really, really struggled to reconcile what I was taught, you know, what life should look like or what my life should look like and what it was going to be.
And so it was a struggle and it absolutely eroded my mental health. It eroded my love for my sport because I thought to myself, oh my God, I have this secret and no one knows. And I felt that was very dishonest, kind of a, you know, omitting this truth about myself.
And I thought to myself, oh my God, if people only see me as a speed skater, as what I do, then that must be the only reason why I, you know, that's, that's my greatest value. That's the only reason people care. And so I attached all my self esteem to my results. And of course that is a one way ticket to not being very fun, having any fun, to burning out because it felt like life or death every time I got to the starting line.
And I lived that way for a good four and a half years really until Sochi came around. And I just, you know, knew that, I knew the struggles that I had with the, with the amount of privilege I was brought up with. You know, I was always surrounded by the Best friends, great family, two loving, supporting parents.
You know, played sports, liked school. Like I'm a really lucky person. And I just thought to myself, if this is how I'm feeling growing up in Canada, I can't even imagine being a Russian youth and having a government say, you know, linking you to pedophilia and all of these horrific things.
So it was a no brainer, to be honest, because I, I just, I couldn't, I could not live with myself. Truly. Arem, if I knew that I could have said something and I didn't like it. Just, it was too big of an opportunity for me to hopefully help someone else because I didn't have any help when I was, when I was trying to maneuver it and it wasn't from anyone's fault or, you know, there's not one area that let me down. It just was not a conversation in sport 10 years ago.
[00:26:54] Speaker B: Right, right.
[00:26:55] Speaker A: It wasn't a conversation. Like it's, it's wild to think how, how quickly it has changed. There's still progress to be made, of course, but yeah, I felt like an alien and I was like, I cannot let anyone feel the way I'm feeling. Like I, I at least need to say my name and my, Someone needs to hear it. Then I got to believe that they'll hear it. But I just didn't want anyone to feel the weight of the world and the loneliness that I felt in some of my formative years.
[00:27:23] Speaker B: Could we take a step back for a sec and then go into the actual conversation? You said something I found super fascinating, really illuminating is because you weren't able to be honest with people yet to let people into this part of your life that you viewed so much of what of really your only worth was your results as skating and how every time you went up to skate it was life and death.
Can you tell more about that? Like when people are just so hyper focused on this one thing and don't have other connectivity in their life, how that can create that kind of life or death response, a psychological response.
[00:28:00] Speaker A: Well, you had said a few, you know, a few minutes ago, the difference between healthy competitive energy and, and negative. Right. And, and I think that was exactly it. Like I, I would literally go to the line thinking, oh my God, if I don't skate well, I know I'm going to struggle to get out of bed for the next 48 hours. Like I, I remember skating in Japan at a World cup once and I crossed the line and I truly hated myself. Like, like on tv. I'm sure you could. It was probably bleeped out, but I swore at myself in front of everyone because I knew it wasn't going to be good. And it just, it. It was such a downward spiral, unfortunately, because I was just not grounded. I wasn't.
I. I didn't love myself. And it's so hard. You know, I really think that your relationship with yourself dictates every other relationship you have and your outlook in the world. And I. I was just in such a bleak, bleak, bleak place.
And the. Yeah, the negative psychological spiral, I mean, they've done so many. So many psychological, you know, tests, and academia has measured the. The success correlation to psychological safety. And I had no psychological safety. And so, yes, there were moments when I could have a good race and I'd be walking two feet off the sidewalk and I'd think I was the queen, which was also not healthy. Like, what? Because I could have sk. I skated around in a circle fast that one day that means I'm like a good person or I'm more important than anyone else. Like, absolutely not. But when you're so in the weeds, right? Like, these are the lies that we tell ourselves.
And it's.
Yeah, it's. It's something that I regularly bring up with my therapist, to be honest, even though I've been retired for a few years. Like, it, you know, it sticks with you, the good and the bad. And it's been an all you can eat buffet for me with speed skating. But certainly some of those negative aspects. Yeah, it takes a long time to learn to forgive yourself.
One step.
[00:30:11] Speaker B: One step.
[00:30:16] Speaker A: One step beyond.
