Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Hey, everyone. Welcome back. Today's guest is someone that I am really stoked to have on the show. Monica and I were a little surprised that he said yes, not because he's, you know, like some person you can't get to. He's really approachable, wonderful person. Just a little surprised, you know, that they were like, yeah, yeah, I'd be into doing it. And it's also someone who's played a very integral role in our family and especially with our kids growing up. So we're super psyched to have Jonathan here. Before we get into it, though, please rate, review, and subscribe to the podcast. Especially subscribe and put on your notifications so you don't miss an episode. My name is Aram Arslanian, and this is one step beyond Jonathan. Welcome to the show.
[00:01:00] Speaker B: Oh, nice to meet you, or nice to see you again.
[00:01:02] Speaker A: All right, so for the uninitiated, for those who don't know, who are you and what do you do?
[00:01:07] Speaker B: So my name is Jonathan Hutchinson. I'm the youth coordinator at DS Combat Sports.
I'm a jiu jitsu coach. I'm an mma coach down at that gym, and I do all sorts of stuff with the program down there.
[00:01:20] Speaker A: Okay. Yeah, dude, there's so much to unpack. But before we get into it, our family, Monica and I, and of course, Leora, like our daughter, we are huge, huge fans of DC's. We are huge fans of you and the whole program. So first, just thank you for everything that you do.
[00:01:37] Speaker B: It's really no problem. I'm getting so much more out of it than everyone else is. Trust me, it means a lot to me.
[00:01:43] Speaker A: So, like, there's so much to explore here, but if you just gave us, like, a general overview of the gym, you know, we've had Ryan on here before, but just a general overview of the gym and then the specific programs that you.
[00:01:55] Speaker B: 100%. So the gym itself is a gym, like, in the heart of the downtown east side. It was started by Ryan Diaz. He. I've known him since I was 18 when I moved to the city. I met him pretty much right away, and he, like, took me under his wing and really helped, like, grow me as a person and grow me as an instructor. When the gym first started, it was just a tiny, little, like, place when I was there. And then just slowly through time, we would have, like, too many people, and we'd have to find a new space, and too many people would have to find a new space. And now it's a beautiful little spot, like, nestled right on Pender street.
It's a really cool environment to be a part of because it's about, of all the places that I've been, like, it's so much about community and about family and about fostering, like, a really good community.
So it's a beautiful spot. And then myself, I run a lot of the kickboxing programs. So a lot of the kickboxing classes, I help out with the MMA team, I compete competitively in jiu jitsu, so I travel around and I do that quite a bit. I also run the Jiu JitsU programs during the day. And then, like I said, I'm the youth coordinator, so I'm there for all the different kids classes. Whether it's jujitsu or kickboxing or wrestling or boxing, I'm always around. If you ever come to a kids class, I'll be around somewhere. And that's my kind of my main role at the. At the gym. Yeah.
[00:03:17] Speaker A: So how did you get into the youth side of it?
Yeah, it's an interesting thing, like, when people talk about, let's say, any kind of work.
[00:03:26] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:03:28] Speaker A: My background is a therapist. And back in the early days of when I first started working in addiction and mental health, you didn't actually have to have, like, a lot of, at least in BC, a lot of credentials to do addiction work. And you'd meet these people who had master's degrees, but you also meet people who just had lived experience.
And then over the years, there was a big push for accreditation, like, master's degrees and all that. And the thing that always stuck out to me is like, well, just because someone has a master's degree doesn't mean they're actually good at working with people.
[00:03:56] Speaker B: 100%. Yeah.
[00:03:57] Speaker A: So I'm always interested when we're talking about, like, youth programming and creating things that are, like, really help people grow.
A, I want to know, like, how you got into it, and b, what are your thoughts? Like, do you have to have any kind of specific expertise or training to do that, or is it. Is it okay just to have, like, a good mix of people?
[00:04:14] Speaker B: A lot of it actually comes down to how I grew up. So my dad was a mechanic and a kickboxer, so I grew up with a lot of martial arts in the house. But my mom ran a dance school, like, so she. She ran a small dance school. So I grew up around watching my mom run the school and teach kids. And, like, my mom has plenty of accreditations within dance, but the thing that makes her special is the way that she interacts with children. Like, I remember growing up and watching her and, like, to this day, like, no, nobody that I've ever met is as good at, like, making three year olds sit still as my mom. She's awesome at it. And just, like, the patience and the love that was there was really, really profound. So I grew up with that. And then also, I started fencing at a young age. So I had a wonderful fencing coach named Victor when I was growing up, and he taught me a lot about how to think in the future and to think about high performance and building athletes one step at a time.
And then my first job on the Sunshine coast, which is where I grew up, there wasn't, like, there was no fencing on the coast.
And when I first decided to get, like, a job, one of the first things that came up was, like, teaching at the rec center. So I was teaching at the rec center. When I was, like, 13, I was running a fencing program. And so I made a lot of my mistakes very young in terms of, like, teaching kids. The other thing that I think was really helpful about that is that I learned to teach kids while I was still a kid. So at that time, it was much easier for me to connect with a young. With someone who was like, if I'm 1314 and they're like, ten, I remember what it was like to be ten. And then I started a gym on the Sunshine coast for fencing when I was 16, and I ran that till I was 20. So I also had a lot of experience there. So I think when you're dealing with children, the first thing is, like, a predisposition of patience, like, being patient and loving and caring and, like, understanding that, like, your goal is for everyone to become the best version of themselves. It's not to be the world champion. It's not to be all this stuff. It's to be the best version of themselves and to help them achieve whatever it is they want to achieve. I remember telling somebody once, they're having, like, a really, really hard day at training, and I was like, listen, if you came to me and you told me that, hey, you want to be a figure skater, I wouldn't get mad at you for not wanting to fight anymore. I would phone the best figure skating coach I know and say, like, hey, I've got someone who has a lot of potential. And I would say whatever I have to say to make sure you get in their program, because that's. That, I think, is what fosters.
Fosters, like, strong people, is having that community. Yeah.
[00:07:04] Speaker A: So your experience then is like your ability to work with people. It's all experiential. It's first being modeled on, seeing what your mom did and then growing up, being coached, being mentored and transitioning that there wasn't any specific training you took.
[00:07:19] Speaker B: I did. So I did the NCCP, like, level one coaching. It's like, for all of the national, all the different sports programs. So I did that. I did in school. I went and I did a course in coaching youth programs. But to be honest, I had an experience where I went into it and I was like, oh, they're teaching us how to line kids up.
Well, I've been doing that for a long time.
I feel like experience is the best. The things that I believe the programs that people really, really need are programs like Safesport, where they teach people how to interact with children in a way that is safe for everyone in the community, where we all are all checking each other, if that makes sense. So safe. Sport is really important. If you haven't had any training, then an NCCP level one program or anything that teaches you the basic layout of how to structure classes or how to build a program or how to build a program that progresses week by week by week in a curriculum I think is really important. I feel like the. When I've had people come in and start to be an instructor, one of the biggest kind of, like, nervous moments, like, if kids feel the nervousness of disorganization, they'll, like, they're gonna go into their own world and do their own thing. So having, like, structure is really important. And that's the first thing I tell people to do, is to learn how to do that. The other thing I tell people to do is there's a specific role that I feel, at least for me, really helped me understand the relationship that I need to have with the students. And I say it's like the older brother that went off to military school. So what you want to be is you want to be old enough like you. You want to put on this role where you're. You're old enough and wise enough and, like, have enough life experience that when you tell them to do something, like, okay, yeah, for sure. You know, yeah, this is that kind of person. But you also want to be, like I said, an older brother, where you're not a parent, you're not telling them what to do. You're still a friend. But everyone had, like, I had friends like that when I was a kid. I grew up in a small town. I'm like a nine year old kid running around and sometimes there'd be the 14 year old kid there and we're all laughing, joking, having a good time, and then he's like, hey. And you're like, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure. Like, that's kind of where you want to be. You want to have that relationship where they feel so comfortable that they feel comfortable enough to be themselves but still respectful enough that they listen to the class. It's kind of like where you want to be.
[00:09:55] Speaker A: Do you mind if I put in my take on expertise?
[00:09:58] Speaker B: Yeah, for sure. 100%.
[00:09:59] Speaker A: I've known a ton of people with master's degrees who are therapists, who are amazing, totally amazing.
The most important mentor for me was a woman that I worked with that had no formal education as a therapist. She was kind of grandfathered in because she'd been a therapist for so long. I learned the most about patient care, the most about meeting people where they're at, like being humble, like learning and all this. And it doesn't mean that I think going to structured education and getting like accreditation or degrees or all that is bad. In fact, I think it's fantastic.
But to create a barrier where people who don't have that can't enter an industry I think is a very poor thing because it kind of takes all types. And again, if I go through the business world, I know a ton of people with MBAs who are like actually really good, like totally awesome. And I also know a lot of people with MBAs who totally suck, don't know what they're doing.
For me, it's so much more about like how people learn and apply what they learn, how quickly they're, they're able to do that, how self reflective they are and then their ability to like find sources of coaching or mentoring and like really bring all that stuff in. So I don't think there's an either or. But where I always get a little sticky is like barriers to entry into an industry and also, like, pay rates are associated with that. Yeah, because someone who has a master's level is going to get paid more with someone who doesn't have a master's. But that doesn't mean they're actually better at their job. And those are like concern things where from an industry perspective, always, like, I don't know, I think there's better ways of doing stuff.
[00:11:23] Speaker B: Yeah, no, 100%. I agree with all of that. Like all the, all the most important things that I've learned. Like, I've learned important things from people like my, my first fencing coach Victor, he had gone to school in the Ukraine to become a fencing coach, like, and he is absolutely phenomenal. He's one of the best coaches I've ever met. Then I had another coach, Mister Fox, who didn't wrestle at all. Started learning to coach wrestling, to be a wrestling coach. Like, there were like kids that were like, we want to wrestle, and we used to wrestle before and we want a program, but we need a teacher to sign off on it. And he's like, yeah, sure, I'll do it. And then he, like, learned to wrestle through that and he was absolutely amazing, too. And in, like, all this other hosts of ways. So we've got. I've learned from all sorts of people. And I think what you're saying in terms of, like, going and searching out, like, mentorship is probably the most important thing. Like, finding people that are doing what it is that you love to do, that have been doing it for a long time and have ways of applying it, because everybody in life finds their own ways to go about things, and that doesn't mean that it's your way, but seeing how somebody else does something can help you shape the way that you do it. Okay. Was that an easier way for them? Was it? Does that way work for me?
Does that. Does that make things? Or maybe this is how most people in the industry are doing it. So if I do it a little bit differently, then I can make it happen this way. But having that experience with all these people is really, really, really vital, I think.
[00:12:54] Speaker A: Yeah, I want to hit on fencing because I'm really interested in it, for sure. But before we get to fencing, I'm not looking for, like, a right or wrong here. Just want to know your thoughts on it. Is there any difference in your mind between mentoring and coaching?
[00:13:07] Speaker B: Yeah, so, actually I have. I say that there's three kinds. One, when I'm talking to people who are starting to teach, I say that there's three kinds of, like, instructors, right? There's. There's teachers, which I think would be closer to mentor if we want to, like, put them in the same. But I call them teachers. There's trainers and there's coaches. And understanding what your role is is really, really, really important. And I'll go through all three of those roles throughout the day at different times. I just make sure that I know which one I am. So a teacher or a mentor. My job is to make sure that you know more when you leave than when you came in. You know more about jiu jitsu, you know more about kickboxing, you have a deeper understanding of the sport. Your love and your passion and the fire for the sport has been, has been fanned. And you, you like, you feel the energy of what the sport is. That's like a teacher. I think about like the best teachers I knew in high school. Like Mister Stoddard was a law teacher, was. Every time I left his class, I knew more about law and I wanted to know more. That's a teacher. A trainer is someone who's supposed to help you with specific physical goals. And that could be like being stronger, being faster. But in the terms of sports or combat sports, that could be like reaction time. So like today we're working on these specific drills and these specific things. Then I. So my job might be to like make your jab better or to make your slip tighter or to work on like different ways of defending a right hand. So the teacher, when I'm a teacher role, my job is to teach you the different ways of defending the right hand. Then when I'm your trainer, my job is to throw the right hand at you and have you counter it over and over again until it's like muscle memory. Now, the coach is a very specific role. The coach's job is for you to be the best you can be and win. That's the job. Right? So, like, I think a really good coach, like when we think maybe coach is the wrong term, but when you think of like a really good coach, like when I think about Victor, sometimes he wouldn't tell you everything that you needed to know, but he told you what you needed to know at that moment to be successful at that time, that's what a coach is. So, like, when I come in to be a coach of a team and I run like a training, if you're running like a training, if I'm not in the teacher role and I'm not in the instructor role, well, my job is to make sure that they get better at winning. So we're working on mentality, we're working on, we're making sure that we have specific habits. We're working on specific things for that fight coming up. You're fighting this opponent, so maybe you're not getting better overall, but you're getting better at the things that will beat that specific opponent. Opponent. Like that's, that's the coach's goal. And when you have an idea of what your goal is, then it's really easy to navigate that path. Like, I know when I, when I teach jujitsu at specific times, during the day, I am a teacher. That's my job. And then certain times when I'm teaching or I'm working with other people, they want to coach or other people want a trainer. So I just put myself into those. Into those roles. So there are. I believe there are differences between all.
[00:16:12] Speaker A: So when I teach people about coaching.
[00:16:14] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:16:14] Speaker A: I say there's. There's three things, and you can do one or the other, but the third one is both combined.
[00:16:22] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:16:22] Speaker A: So you can instruct people.
[00:16:24] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:16:24] Speaker A: And instructing is just showing someone how to do something and getting them to do it, like an iterative process, do it again and again and again and get better and better and better at it. Or you can inspire or influence people. So that's teaching someone to think about something.
[00:16:36] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:16:37] Speaker A: So that would be you're not actually doing the thing, you're just like, how you think about doing the thing and then coaching would have both of those underneath it.
[00:16:45] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:16:46] Speaker A: And the degree of how much you're instructing someone versus how much you're influencing or aspiring them would have to do with, like, what the situation is.
[00:16:52] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:16:53] Speaker A: So I'll give you an example. A driving instructor. Yes, a driving instructor. When you first start teaching someone how to drive, you're just instructing them. You're just showing them how to drive. But then the better they get a driver driving, then you drive, then you're also telling them how to think about it. But the more advanced they're getting at it, you're teaching them more and more how to be a good citizen of the road, how to drive defensively, how to manage road rage. So when the thing about road rage, it's like they're not bringing out a crazy driver attacking you, but you're thinking about it, and, like, this is how you'd handle that. Like, this is how you psychologically have to be in that space. So a driving instructor, although they're called an instructor, the instructing decreases over time, but the influencing and inspiring thinking increases over time. So they're kind of coaching the whole time. Yes, but in some places, you're just literally just instructing people. And a good leader could be doing all three in a day, just like you're saying. So that's the way that I describe it to people.
[00:17:44] Speaker B: Yeah, that's. That's a wonderful way of describing it to people.
[00:17:47] Speaker A: Let's go into fencing.
[00:17:48] Speaker B: Yeah, for sure.
[00:17:49] Speaker A: I am fascinated by fencing. Like, how does one, like, what got you into fencing?
[00:17:55] Speaker B: Okay, so when I was really young, like, like the only sport in the house. In my house was. Was MMA and UFC. Like, that was it, like. And I fell in love with it at a very young age. But my. My mom was quite opposed to me getting hit in the head at a young age, which is very fair.
Totally fair. So when we were thinking about different combat sports and different martial arts to do and different stuff like that, I started doing, like, wrestling, jiu jitsu, and, like, I kind of. The Sunshine coast is really small, so kind of like an MMA type thing. It was, like, in a gi.
I don't know. It was about 20 something years ago now, so it was, like, in a gi with MMA gloves, and there was sparring and hitting some pads and stuff, but then you're also kind of grappling, so it was like that kind of thing. So I started all of that pretty young, but at the same time, there was a fencing program that was going on up at the school, and at the time, my grandfather had just passed away, and my parents brought me to go stay with them for a little bit. And there was a fencing program that was, like, right, like, right there. Like, okay, go. And you can go and try this thing. And I went and I tried it out, and I really, really loved it. I fell in love with it, like, really young. I really love. What I love about all combat sports is the act of competing with somebody else. It doesn't need to be in a competition. It can be the sparring or whatever, but it's the game that's being played. I really love it, and that's why I love jujitsu, is you get to play the game every day. That's why I love fencing. You get to play a game every day. You gonna. You're gonna go, and me and you are gonna compete, and we're gonna. We're gonna figure stuff out, and I'm gonna win, I'm gonna lose, and I'm gonna feel things, and I'm gonna figure things out through the application of what I'm doing, which I really love. So I started with that, and then I had, like I said, I had a wonderful coach, and I ended up. And the. The people around me at that time ended up doing quite, like, quite well. So I kept going with it and kept going with it and kept going with it as long as I was being fairly successful. And then when I was, like, 16, I really, really wanted to focus on fighting, and one of the ways. So I kind of pulled back from fencing. But at the time, I was coaching at the rec center. So now we're back on the Sunshine coast. I'm coaching at the rec center. I decided I'm not going to because I was actually commuting to Richmond to go train. So I was on Fridays, I would skip the last two blocks of school. I would go. I'd train Friday, Saturday, and I'd come back. So I couldn't do that anymore. I wanted to focus on my wrestling and this. So I came back, but I was still running this program at the rec center, and I had a couple kids. How I used to end class is, I would tell stories about competing. I'd be like, oh, I remember one time I was here, and the hotel caught fire and da da da da, and all this stuff, and I had a team of kids, about six of them. They were like, hey, we want to compete. Like, we love what you're saying. We want to compete. And I was like, oh, yeah, you guys should probably go get a coach. You know? I'm like a 16 year old kid. You should probably go get a coach. Like, yeah, we got one. We got you. And I'm like, I'm not a coach. Like, I have no, like, I can, like, kind of teach, but I had no idea that I even knew anything about. I was like, I don't know anything about this. Like, I grew up around people who had coached national teams for, like, Ukraine and Israel and all these other countries, and, like, I never.
I was like, I don't know what I'm doing.
But I also knew how much I had to give up in order to travel all the way to Vancouver to go and to go and train. So I was like, okay, we'll start a program here for you guys. So it was just six kids when I started my own little gym, and that was my first experience really, really coaching. That's where I went from, like, you're saying an instructor to, like, a coach. There's a team of kids. I remember one of the first conversations, I asked them, I said, hey, do you want to be good? Like, you go to a tournament, and everyone's like, oh, my God. Like, for a small town, these kids are so good. Like, man, it's incredible. I'm like, or do you want to be good? Do you want to, like, show up and have people be like, all right. They showed up. Shit, which one do you want? And the kids were like, we want to be good. Like, really good. So that gave me a whole, like, different. Not just a different perspective, but a whole way to kind of approach coaching that I hadn't done before, where it was like, all trying to, like, make them come together as a team and make them the best that they could be. Like, really the best that they could be. And that was such a cool experience for me. And I trained them for, for four years. One of them is actually still on the, like, he went, after he stopped training with me, he went and started training with my old coach, and he's actually on the national team, so he went on to do quite well. But that was such a beautiful experience for me, was working with those kids.
[00:22:52] Speaker A: I love that, man. You were talking about competition.
[00:22:55] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:22:55] Speaker A: Competitions are a real interesting thing. When I was, I don't know, like, when I was younger, I had this whole thing about how I was like, oh, I'm not competitive person. You know, I'm not competitive. And my friends would always be like, you're so full of shit.
The most competitive person. I was like, oh, you know, I'm just competitive with myself. And they're like, no, no. Like, you're super competitive. And it was weird because I had kind of grown up, there wasn't, like, a big focus on sports or anything in my house. And so I always kind of thought of competition being like, this really, like, toxic bad thing that it was like, you're out to beat people at the same time being, like, ultra competitive and, like, refusing to acknowledge that. And then I got older and I got into it. I got. I could accept that I was competitive and was able to start doing it in, like, a good and healthy way. Yes, because there's a lot of, like, bad behavior, like, negative behaviors about the way that I kind of had tried to, like, suppress that side of myself. However, competition and being competitive in modern times can sometimes get press. Like. Like, people can speak about it like, it's like a toxic, toxic, toxic thing. And I've come to really realize there's, like, a lot of, like, I hate to sound corny, but it's, like, a lot of beauty in competition, and it brings out, like, really good stuff. So what are your thoughts on just the idea of competition?
[00:24:14] Speaker B: My perspective on, like, competition and my perspective, my. It's kind of like, my perspective on. On, on everything, which is that, like, at the end of the day, like, the reason why you see two martial artists, like, bow to each other and go out there and fight and do the best that they can do, the reason why they bow and the reason why they show so much respect a lot of times, and most of the time is because I need you to make me the best I can be. I require you, like, we require each other in order for me to be who I must be and to do what I love. I require somebody else with the bravery and the courage to do what I want to do and do what I love with me and you. So competition, like, I never saw it as, like. Like, I understand that how sometimes it makes people act. It can be this thing that might be toxic, but competition itself is a beautiful thing. Like, that's. I've learned more about myself, like, not just competing in events, but, like, I've learned more about myself in the. In the conflict than I've learned about myself. Like, I've learned more about the peace in myself through conflict than I have learned about the peace of myself through sitting. You know what I mean? Like, it's the. It's the push and pull where you get to figure out who you are, and it's the push and pull where you get to figure out if that's who you want to be. Like, I have a story that I tell people.
My father told me when I was really young. I remember talking to him after a really hard training session. I'm like, I don't know, eight or nine. And I'm like, I want to quit. I want to quit.
Not quit doing this, but I wanted to quit the thing. And as a kid, I was a very competitive kid. I was very calm and very nice, but I don't like to lose. And I was a very competitive kid, and I wanted, like, I was like, I wanted to quit doing this exercise. My dad goes, everyone wants to quit because it's okay. Everybody wants to quit.
He goes, let me tell you a story. I go, okay. So he sits with me, and he goes, John, you have to push yourself. Do you want to quit every single day? He goes, you see, there's a door over there. That door, when the door opens, a man will come through it, and he'll grab you, and he'll throw you through the door, and that is quitting. That's when you've pushed so hard. The man comes through the door, and he picks you up. He throws you up. So you know what you do the next day? You train just as hard again. Just as hard. So that man opens the door, he comes in, he picks you up, he throws you back out the door. He goes, you know what you do the day after that? You do the same thing, and the man will come to the door and picks you up. And this time you go, my name's John. Nice to meet you. And he throws you out the door, and you do it again. And then you ask him what his name is, and you ask him about his wife, and you ask him about his kids, and you ask him about his family, and you ask him about all these things in his life, and you get to know him every time he throws you out that door. And then if one day the door opens and he comes through it and he picks you up, if you've met that man enough times, you can go, hey, I know your wife. I know your kids. I know you're struggling.
I've known you a long time. You're a good friend of mine. Can I have 10 seconds?
And if you've made a good relationship with that man, he'll give you 10 seconds. So, for me, that was really important.
[00:27:27] Speaker A: That's super powerful.
You know, I being, like, an ultra competitive person, and I'm competitive in business because, you know, my family has a business that we run. Been competitive in music, like, very competitive. But I was just like, I just want to live, like, a good life.
[00:27:46] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:27:47] Speaker A: And so, like, I'm real competitive about just, like, being a good dad, being good partner. Like, I. It might sound strange like that, but it's like, yeah, like, I want to be, like, the best husband I can be. I want to be the best father I can be. And I really focused on that.
We were just in Palm Springs recently, and we were there with. With our family, who's from here, and then our family from Texas, and our. All the kids were playing in the pool, and our youngest, Leora, they were playing this game, treasure hunt, where they would take a ball, they'd throw it in the pool. Then you had to swim to get it. And Leora was getting beat because there's kids from all different ages and not beat all the time, but she was getting beat once in a while, and she started getting frustrated and crying because she wasn't winning. And suddenly I found myself having what I felt was, like, the most important conversation of my, like, being a dad, because we're talking about losing and how important it is and, like, managing that, but also still competing even when you know you're not gonna win. And what was super cool about it is, like, Leora was a not having it at all. She was like, no, but, like, talking to her about it and thinking about all the times in my life where, like, losing was, like, the best thing that had happened to me 100%. And all the times in my life where I totally ate shit and, like, became better, and all the times where in my life where I won because I'd like, all those were kind of flashing in my head, and at the same time, all of her cousins came over who were competing against her, and they were all talking about losing and how they lost and why they're not going to take it easy or honor in the game and all this. And suddenly we were having this whole thing, family conversation, where, like, Addison and Ryland and Kennedy, which are, like, some of her cousins, were all weighing in on this, and Quinn and Rory, who weren't in the pool, were also talking about it, and Leora, who, again, who still was not having it, was, like, slowly being talked through this thing, and then through the rest of the day, she was able to compete and lose and still didn't like it, but could kind of put it in her space, in her head. And it's just so funny to me about, like, that idea of competition seems to have been distorted to being only the most toxic. Like, you know, people talk a lot, like, oh, like alpha male, blah, blah, blah. That's, like, the smallest part of competition, where the biggest part is, like, what you said is, like, figuring out who you. Who you are and who you want to be.
[00:30:09] Speaker B: Yeah, that is. That is it. Like, that's such a cool thing that you got to have that conversation with Leora, because that is such an important part of life, and that's why I love martial arts so much. It's losing well.
Learning to lose well or learning to, like, if learning to have the courage to compete, even when you know that there is no way that you can win, that's a beautiful thing. That's something like, like, I've seen. I've done a lot of reading on it, and, like, some people call it. They call it great courage, the absence of fear that comes from knowing you are exactly where you must be. Right. And for me, that's such a powerful thing where you're like, it doesn't matter. Like, I know that the odds are so far against me, but that's okay because there's beauty in the act of doing, in the. Just in the being there, because if you weren't willing to lose for it, then, like, it wasn't really worth doing, right?
[00:31:12] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:31:12] Speaker B: Yeah, totally. Yeah.
[00:31:14] Speaker A: I was telling you earlier, we. I grew up in music, and Mike, our engineer, grew up in music, and there's something about being the band on the bill. That's the band that nobody gives a shit about. That's really good for you.
[00:31:27] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:31:27] Speaker A: Because it's, like, the band that everybody came to see, right? The headliner, or maybe not the headliner, but some band on the bill that everyone's, like, super psyched on, and then the band that it's not that people hate on them, they just don't give a shit. And the idea that it's like, I have no chance of being the best band here, I'm gonna get paid no matter what. You know, we'll sell some t shirts no matter what. But our job is not to be the best band of the night. Our job is to make the best band of the night go, oh, shit. Like, that band's pretty damn good.
Our job is to be a band that people are talking about even though they didn't come to see us. And that idea of, like, there's literally no way we're gonna be the band of the night.
And for anyone who says music's not competitive, like, you're joking yourself, because music creative and all those things, but everyone wants to go to a show and rock and have everyone come out and be like, damn, they were great. And 95% of the time, you are not the band that people are coming to see, but your job is to show up and blow anyone off the stage that you can and totally take over the show if possible. And I love that idea of, like, really knowing there's no way I'm gonna win, but I'm gonna put on a goddamn good show anyways.
[00:32:38] Speaker B: I'm gonna do the best. So, Chris, we call him Hulk. He runs the older kids jiu jitsu program. He came in, and he's been coaching the mma program now for, I think it's a couple years, but it might be a little smaller than that. But he's had such a huge impact on my life, and he's got this thing that he tells. Tells the fight team all the time, where, of course, it's always about competing and doing the best you can do, and you're trying, like, you want to win, you have to do this. But more important than that, he would always say, make them remember you.
Make them remember you. That's what you want. He goes, you want a good fight? Make them remember you. Make them remember the time that they fought, you know, Jonathan, or make them remember the time that they fought case or ale or make them remember the time that they fought, Chris, like, in their head, they make that a moment, whether they won or lost. Whether you won or lost, that they're like, that fight. I remember that. Yeah.
[00:33:34] Speaker A: So let's talk a bit about your jujitsu career.
[00:33:37] Speaker B: Yeah, for sure.
[00:33:37] Speaker A: So when did you switch over to that being kind of, I guess, your main ish thing.
[00:33:42] Speaker B: Yeah. So I started. So, like I said, I stopped fencing when I was, like, 16, and then wrestling was my main thing for.
I would probably even say, like, maybe like, 16 to 18. I, like, only was focusing. I was wrestling before that, but I was only focusing on wrestling then. Then I moved to Vancouver. I started going to school at SFU, and I knew I wanted to be an MMA coach, and that's what I wanted to do. It's been. It's. That was my dream since I was really young.
So I went and I found Ryan, and he, like, took me in, helped teach me how to do, how to. How to be a better instructor, how to be a better coach, how to, like, make a living doing this, which I had no concept on how to do, because before and when I was there and working with him, that's when I started focusing on MMA in particular. And then I would say focusing strictly on Jiu Jitsu happened more about two years ago. So I was always training Jiu Jitsu, but competing in Jiu Jitsu wasn't my main focus. My main focus was either competing in MMA or coaching MMA or doing something associated with that. And Jujitsu was an integral part of that. And then just recently, have I started, like, competing in Jiu Jitsu, like, traveling and trying to compete in Jiu Jitsu.
[00:34:49] Speaker A: So what is it about Jiu Jitsu?
[00:34:51] Speaker B: Couple things. Number one, I love the fact that it reminds me of, like, when I was fencing and when I was wrestling. Like, to go to a tournament. There's not very many places in the world where you can just sign up and go compete with the best people in the world.
That's amazing. I can, like, you can just go figure it out. Like, let's go. All right, we've got three world champions in this bracket. Let's go to that tournament. LEt's Go compete against them. Let's go see who you are. Like, you can. You don't have to convince anyone to, like, take a chance on me because I'm really good, and there's none of that. You're just like, okay, I go and let's. Let's see if. Let's see how good I am. Let's figure it out. You go against a world champion, maybe you get smashed. You go against SoMebody, maybe you don't, and, like, you can. You can go and do that, I think, is really cool. I also like the fact that in, lIke, JujItsu, I'm really looking forward to the fact that I can do Jujitsu forever. So, like, I can do kickboxing and all the other martial arts for a LoNg time. But there's going to become a time where I said, what I love about doing martial arts for myself is the sparring aspect of the competing aspect of it, the fighting aspect of it. There will come a time where it's going to be harder for me to do that in the other sports. But in Jiu Jitsu, there are many people that do Jiu Jitsu well into their seventies and eighties. And that's something that I love, is that I can be connected to the sport I love in a way that I really love. Last time we were at an EVEnT, they have masters, three and four divisions, which means you've got people again competing in their sixties and seventies, which I think is awesome. So you get to go and be a part of that. So that's two of the big things, like Jiu jitsu. It's like a lot of a cultural aspect I really love. It's the ability to go and test yourself against the best in the world that I really love, and the ability, the longevity of it is something that I really enjoy, like, for myself. Yeah.
[00:36:39] Speaker A: So if you're thinking from, like, kids programs, because I know there's a number of kids programs at DC's, do you have a leaning over which, which of the martial arts is better for kids or are they all great?
[00:36:50] Speaker B: I actually had this conversation with somebody, okay.
It has no bearing on the sport whatsoever. Zero. What's important is the coach.
You find a good instructor. You find someone who knows how to teach kids. Because teaching kids is a completely different thing than coaching adults. It's completely different. You can have a great adult instructor that is terrible with kids. You can have a terrible adult instructor that's great for kids. You can have somebody who's amazing at both.
It's a hard thing to find, but if you find the right kids instructor, they will learn discipline, respect, hard work, how to learn. They will learn those things. Whether they're doing boxing or they're doing jiu jitsu or they're playing pickleball, it doesn't matter. It's the instructor that matters. It's the way that they interact with the kids. It's the lessons and the ways that they draw conclusions about how this aspect of the sport reflects life and how it can teach you about life. Life can build into the sport and, like, it's that that allows someone to really grow and the passion for it. If somebody is really passionate, like kids can feel passion. It's why, like, like, Hulk's program is so amazing. Like, when you go up there and watch it, like, I implore you, like, go up there and just watch him teach a class. Those kids are super disciplined right there, focused the whole time. And it's not because he's, like, yelling at them. It's because they respect him. And they respect him because he is so passionate and so caring and so empathetic towards these. They know he would walk through fire for those kids. And kids can feel that. They're like, man, like this. They care not about just what we're doing, they care about what we're doing, but they care about me. And that's one of the things I always, when I try to teach kids, I try to, especially because I work with a lot of young kids. I call it, like, I remember somebody telling me to define my terms once in school. So I define my terms a lot because a lot of people will be like, you don't respect me or you don't respect this, the kids. So one day I was like, who can tell me what respect is? And when kid raises his hand and they go, it's listening, I'm like, that's completely wrong.
But it's not the kid's fault. I don't think I've ever been angry at a kid. It's not the kid's fault.
People are yelling at them that respect, and they're just associating respect with listening because that's how it was kind of taught. And so I started, like, trying to figure out a way to explain, explain it to kids. So what I'll do now is I do this every once in a while. Go, like, can somebody tell me what respect is? And you always hear, listening to your coach. And I go, no, that's something you do if you respect them. But that's not respect.
You know, whatever. Sitting still, doing this, doing that. And then I tell them, I say, respect is when you feel someone or something is important.
If I feel that this person is important, that means I respect them. So all the things you said about listening, about not talking while I'm talking about all that stuff, that's always. That you show me that you think I'm important.
So do you think I'm important? And the kids usually always go, yeah, of course. And then I'm like, okay, so when you don't do those things, what are you telling me? Like, oh, that you're not important. I'm like, yeah. So I know that's not what you mean to say, what you're trying to say is, let's have fun and have a good time, because I like hanging out with you. But what you're saying is that you don't think what we're doing is important. And then. So when you start teaching kids how to communicate through. Through. Just through their actions as well, I feel like that. I don't know. I feel like that really, really gives something to the program, to those kids. And again, like I was saying, like, it's not the. It's not the person, it's not the program. It's the teachers and the coaching staff and the instructors and how much they care about the kids.
[00:40:38] Speaker A: So, speaking of coaching and the business of coaching, you mentioned that Ryan taught you how to make money as a coach.
[00:40:44] Speaker B: I was in a very bad spot for a few years. Financially, I was not in a good place, and all because of myself. I could have asked my parents for some help, but I didn't want to put that burden on them. So it was like, self imposed pain in some regards. And I know that they're focusing on.
I didn't want to feel like I was taken from them, and that would kill them to hear me say that. But it's the truth. It was self imposed. And now I've become much better at asking for help. But I didn't think I was like, okay, I'm gonna have to get a job. And then coach, because that, like, the. In the. On the Sunshine coast where I grew up, that was everybody. It was like, oh, he's like the elevator maintenance man, and he teaches kickboxing. Like, it's like that, right? So I thought that's what it was. And then meeting Ryan, Ryan was like, no, you can do this for a living. If you want to do this for a living, you can do it for a living. And it came to a point after working with him for a couple years where I was like, okay, you're right. I'm going to. And so I dropped out of school, and I stopped doing. I was teaching at a few other places and stuff like that. And I just, like, not other martial arts gyms, but a fencing gym on the coast and the fencing gym somewhere else. And then I was just like, okay, I'm just gonna focus on this. And then he taught me how to, like, apply myself in a way to do that. Like, DC's is such a beautiful place, not just for, like, it's beautiful for the community, because it gives people like myself, who was super obsessed with something at a young, like, I have a really particular, like, skill set that I've been obsessed with since I was a kid about, like, coaching and about combat sports and about that. And, like, anywhere else in the world, that's not a skill set. That's monetizable. But here I have the ability to do what I love and live in doing what I love. So, like, I don't have to go work something or go do a job that I don't want to do, where all I'm thinking about is this. I can grow as an athlete and as a coach because my whole life is this. Every day I wake up, I think about martial arts. Every time I go to bed, I'm thinking about martial arts because the first thing I did in the morning was go train, and the last thing I did at night was either teach or train. Like, that's something. It's become part of my daily routine, and that would not be possible without something like DC's, without what Ryan did in the community that he built.
[00:43:07] Speaker A: So if anyone was thinking about, like, hey, I want to go down the path of trying to be, like, a professional coach and, like, really do that. Any suggestions you could be, you could offer people?
[00:43:17] Speaker B: Yes. So first become, like. Like, develop a knowledge base. Like, become skilled at whatever it is that you want to do. You don't have to be, like, the most skilled person ever, but you need. You need skill. Have, like, an understanding of it and a love for it.
Once you do that, then go teach. Teach for free. I did that for a long time. Like, go somewhere and be like, hey, can I run this program or can I help here? Can I do this or can I assist? And, like, go and get experience, like, being with people and teaching people, and then slowly develop your own ways of thinking and believing about coaching. What's important in a program? What's important in a program? And once you've started to do that, things will start to click into place. But a big part of it is just putting in the time that you need to become proficient at the skill and the time that you need to become proficient at the skill of coaching.
And the only way to get a proficient at the skill of coaching is by watching amazing coaches, being around amazing coaches, coaching amazing people, like, just being in that environment. So that's what I, that's what I tell people to do.
[00:44:32] Speaker A: So people who are really passionate, let's say, like artists or athletes or whatever, yeah, they often struggle with the monetization part. Like, how do I ask to get paid a certain amount?
[00:44:42] Speaker B: Yeah, I struggled with that really bad.
[00:44:44] Speaker A: Well, so what can you talk about around that in a way that you're comfortable talking about?
[00:44:48] Speaker B: 100%? I struggled with that for a really long time. It took me time to realize that, like, everything. So, first of all, anything that you love so deeply, I think it was Alan Watts who said this. Anything that you love so deeply that you're willing to dedicate your life to somebody else wants to learn. So, like, of course, if you love it so much that it's what you want to do, somebody else will want to learn it. So learn how to teach it, and you'll be able to monetize whatever it is. The other aspect, the actual asking for money part, that was really, really hard for me, that I needed. Honestly, when I was 16, I had somebody. So I was teaching private lessons for kids for $15, $15 an hour, I think it was. And I was giving them private lessons, which is, like, really low. And I had a parent come in, and she was like, okay, so how much is it? And I was like, oh, it's $15. And she goes, oh, $50. And I was like, no, no, no. Dollar 15. And then she looks at me, and she goes, no, no, no. You meant $50. And then she paid me. I think, for me, having people around me that see the value, like, if you really love it and they see the value in what you do, that helped me see the value in what I was doing. I didn't value what I was doing enough. So I think the monetization aspect of it really has to come down from understanding that you've put so much time and care and love into this thing that by getting paid for it, it doesn't mean that you don't respect what it is or you don't love what it is. The getting paid for it allows you to dive and focus on it more and be even better at your craft. And when you do find people that really deserve to learn it, that can't afford it, now you can give that to them because you are okay. So you have to get into a space where you're okay, and then you can start helping other people.
[00:46:40] Speaker A: There's three things I want to add to that. The story that you just told about, like, that person being like, no, it's dollar 50.
[00:46:45] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:46:46] Speaker A: So the company that I run, Cadence, so, like, we're coaching and corporate education company. So we work with people all over the world, helping them with their leadership, their communication.
At one point, I had someone who's an HR leader in Canada named Aaron who shout out, Aaron, you're the best. I said. She said, how much is coaching? And I told her, and she was like, there's no way I'm paying you that. I'm like, oh, is that too much? She's like, no, that is too little. And she did a market analysis for me and then, like, sent me a document. Is like, this is where you are, and this is where you need to be. You are charging way too little. And I was like, so you're basically telling me I'm selling something to you, and you're telling me that you're not going to pay me. You're going to pay me exponentially more. And she was like, yeah, and if you don't start asking people for that, your company's going to fold. And I was like, well, it's just me. She's like, it's just you today, but it's going to be, like, ten people soon. It'll be 20 people. And she's totally right. She had, like, laid out a timeframe. She taught me how to scale my company without actually understanding that that's what I was learning. So shout out to Aaron. That was like, there are people out there who will help you. Yeah, yeah, like that. Like, the person who said, no, it's $50.
[00:47:59] Speaker B: Nah, it's $50. Yeah.
[00:48:01] Speaker A: But there's two other things I want to hit on. One was where you were like, oh, I was just coaching for free.
[00:48:06] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:48:06] Speaker A: And there's been a big.
And I think there's good sides and bad sides to this. There's been a big push against unpaid internships or giving your time for free. Yeah, I remember when I first started doing this podcast, there are a few people that were like, yeah, how much are you gonna pay me? And I was like, what? Are you kidding me? Pay you to come on my little podcast?
[00:48:27] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:48:27] Speaker A: And, like, I get it. No, but, like, that's outside of the podcast. Like, there are a lot of people. There's a lot of talk about not doing anything unpaid. And part of it I agree with, especially internships, I get a little bit more, like, there should be. Especially if the company's successful. There should be. But there's a ton of stuff that you've got to earn your spot, and you should have to earn your spot by volunteering. I want to get your thoughts on that.
[00:48:50] Speaker B: When I'm talking about. I'm talking about specifically for the person, like, if you love something, if you really, really care about it and you really want to get good at it, you have to do it. You have to do it. Like, a lot of, like, I think maybe it's just. It's just because maybe all I've done is sports. But, like, you pay to compete, you pay to play basketball, you pay to be on team sports, and to be on all these sports. Like, you. You do that. So, like, I'm paying to do it. I would do it for free. Like, I was going and working a job to make a little bit of money so I could go do this thing that I love.
So, yeah, I would do it for free. Why wouldn't I do it for free? But the act of, like, you need to get the reps and the experience doing it again, maybe from the flip side, if I'm, like, running something, I wouldn't ask somebody to do something for free. But if they came up and they were like, hey, I want to be a coach.
I will work and do this for free so I can get experience, then that is a really good way of coming in the door and getting experience. Another story about my father.
My dad told me about the way that he got his first job as a mechanic. The first job he got as a mechanic, he had no experience. He went into a place, he goes, hey, I know I don't have this, this back in the seventies. I know I don't have this, this, this, and this.
I know I'm young. I know I'm all this stuff. He goes, you can pay me minimum wage, and the first time I mess up, you can fire me and I'll leave. You don't have to pay me severance. And the guy was like, cool. And then he came in, amazing mechanic, and then just works his way up.
Or another story that one of my teachers told me is, he was like, if you want to become amazing at something in a specific industry, put yourself anywhere in the industry. Like, if you want to be in movies, like, go put yourself, like, okay, this is really, really cool. Maybe I can, like, mop the floor at the set. Like, put yourself anywhere so that you're around those people and live in that experience. Get to know the people who do it and get to see the people who do it. Like, so, like, for me, I think that's a great. I think it's a great avenue. For me, it worked really, really well. Yeah.
[00:50:59] Speaker A: I'm not encouraging people to, like, go and, like, you know, do these, like, abusive.
[00:51:03] Speaker B: No, no, 100%. I completely understand that.
[00:51:06] Speaker A: The idea, like, because it's just, like, real push against working for free. It's like, listen, like, I paid I paid to go to university.
[00:51:12] Speaker B: No, 100%. That's so interesting. I didn't. I didn't realize that that was going on.
[00:51:17] Speaker A: So, like, I do think, like, successful companies should have paid internships, for sure, like, 1%. But I also think if you're passionate about something and you're like, no, I'm doing this thing. I'm going to figure it out. There's some level of sacrifice that's usually involved to at least get an introduction, and there might not be, but staying open to that. But the second part I wanted to hit on was, you know, when you're paying, getting paid $15 an hour, and it was super low.
[00:51:38] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:51:39] Speaker A: So it was like, when I started this company, I started this company, and I was told, like, I used to work at a bigger coaching firm, and the. The boss at the time, who was really not a cool guy, was like, anyone who leaves here will never be successful. They can never go off and do their own thing. There's too many barriers to entry. Like, you got to have all this expertise. And it was kind of put position, like, if you, like, come here and eat our shit, and if you push back or fire you, or you'll leave and you'll never do anything ever again. And when, like, when I parted ways with that company and I decided to start this company, I was like, oh, no, I'm doing it. I'm going to do it better, but I'm going to charge less. And I made an intentional choice to charge quite, quite a big lesson. And part of it was, I'm going to charge less because I don't want to have a price point that, like, looks like it's bad. Yes, but I do want to have a price point where someone would be like, hmm, you know, like, they're not the big name, but at least we'll consider this, because it is quite a bit cheaper and the guy's experienced.
[00:52:41] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:52:41] Speaker A: So I got in, and I earned my ability to have that conversation with Aaron eventually, where she's like, no, you have to start charging more. And I encourage people, if you're starting on your own, you're trying to get into something. Don't try and, like, hit, like, you know, a pair of market value. Where it's like, well, this is what people are charging. It's like, well, yeah, that's what someone who's super experienced is charging. You should charge less, but you should charge less in a way that's not, like, ridiculously low, but enough where people go, huh? I just want to get your thoughts on that?
[00:53:10] Speaker B: 100%. Like, I think if you go and. And you're doing something on your own, like, you building that experience, building that experience is super important. And not rushing things, like, not being like, okay, well, I'm just gonna go open this huge. Every big, kind of cool business or gym that I've worked for, they always started tiny. They start tiny, and it's like natural growth. It's like, it's that thing that gives it, like, a, like, a solid foundation. People can feel, like, it's weird to say, but people can feel it. People can feel when there's that solid foundation of layers and layers and layers that have been stacked on as opposed to, like, and now we're a big thing. Like, that's the reason why DC's is so successful. It started as this idea and this thing, and it just naturally kept growing. And, like, what? Like, again, like, the way that Ryan ran, it was always so, like, for the community, it's about the community. And watching it grow, grow, grow has been really cool, and it's the same for anything. I feel like if you go and you're doing something on your own, don't be eager to try to feel like you're owed everything right away, because you're not.
When you talk about earning those things or earning your spot, there is a lot of sacrifice that comes to doing anything. There's always sacrifice in whatever you do. And, like, if you're just willing to accept that things will be a little uncomfortable, then you can do whatever you want.
So when I teach the kids, and one of the stories I teach the kids, or one of the things I tell the kids, I say, what's my job?
And a bunch of the kids have been with me long enough now that they know the answer is, your job is to teach me how to learn.
That's my job. My job is not to teach martial arts. That's a cool little thing I get to do, but my job is teach them how to learn. And I say, okay, the reason why I want to teach you how to learn is because most of you will not do what I do for a living. Most of you do will do whatever you want for a living. But if you know how to learn and how to sacrifice specific things, then you can go do whatever you want. Like, let's say there's. Whatever you want is on the other side of this. When I tell the kids, I say, this incredibly cold rain. There's this rain coming down. It's very, very, very cold, and what you want is on the other side of it, if you've never learned how to walk in the rain, you can never get it. So the sacrifice of learning how to go through the rain to get the thing that I want in my life, the life that I would like to be a part of, whether it's I want to do martial arts or be a teacher or be a, I don't know, work as a mechanic, work in construction or be an astronaut or all these different amazing things that kids say that they want to be when they grow up. If that's what you want, you need to be willing to walk through the rain to get there. And I think that comes back to what you were saying about putting yourself in a position where maybe you could be charging more, but to get yourself to the dance and to get people to take a look and to earn your spot where you can charge more, sometimes you got to do what you got to do, right? Yeah.
[00:56:27] Speaker A: All right, so as we're heading to the end here, I'm going to ask you what we call the crucial three.
[00:56:31] Speaker B: Okay.
[00:56:31] Speaker A: There are three questions that are going to get harder as we go along.
[00:56:34] Speaker B: Okay, perfect.
[00:56:35] Speaker A: All right, so first question. Through this, you know, progression in your life. Yeah. Both professionally and personally and as an athlete.
[00:56:43] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:56:43] Speaker A: What's one thing that you learned about yourself that you really like? Something that's been. You've uncovered over time that you're like, I really like that about myself, that.
[00:56:54] Speaker B: I am very empathetic.
Yeah.
[00:56:58] Speaker A: What's one thing that you've learned about yourself that you haven't liked and you've had to work on?
[00:57:05] Speaker B: It's gonna sound weird because I don't want. I don't want it to sound like there's nothing wrong with being nice, but I was too nice, and I had to work on understanding that I could be kind and respectful and courteous, but that doesn't mean that I have to compromise myself for other people.
[00:57:35] Speaker A: Last question. It's something you said before for our interview that I wanted to circle back on. The difference between jiu jitsu or maybe even combat sports in general and other sports is that if something goes. If everything goes right, yeah.
[00:57:56] Speaker B: So, like. And the reason why I feel like a lot of people think that combat sports is, like, scary is because if everything goes right, someone gets hurt. And in all other sports, if everything goes right, nobody gets hurt.
But, yeah, the question.
[00:58:13] Speaker A: So the question is, and just so everyone hears it, if everything goes right in combat sports, someone gets hurt.
[00:58:20] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:58:20] Speaker A: If everything goes right in other sports, nobody.
[00:58:23] Speaker B: Nobody gets hurt.
[00:58:24] Speaker A: Nobody gets hurt. So knowing, that's the. Knowing. That's the everything goes right scenario.
[00:58:29] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:58:30] Speaker A: Why combat sports?
[00:58:32] Speaker B: Well, because it's beautiful.
Because that's what's beautiful about it is the. Like, what's beautiful about it is all the chips are down.
Like, there's something so powerful about the fact that, like, all the chips are down, all of them, and there's no pretense. And I know what I'm gonna do, and you know what you're gonna do, and in a way, that just makes it so. That's so beautiful. Like, I could. I could talk about that forever. There's just the fact that because more than being able to do something, it's like the acceptance. It's the acceptance. You put yourself in a place where you're accepting that anything can happen, that anything can be, and that that's okay.
And if it happens to me, then it happens to me, and that's okay. And if it happens to them and it happens to them, that's also okay. And now we're gonna do this. And, like, that's a. Such a cool thing. Like, I don't feel that.
I haven't felt that anywhere else in life where there is such a truth to it. And you'll hear a lot of boxers and kickboxers and martial artists say that, like. Like, Teddy Atlas has a great quote about how the ring is the chamber of truth. And I think the reason why it's so attractive to so many people is because it is. It's honest. Yeah.
[01:00:00] Speaker A: Oh, yeah.
[01:00:01] Speaker B: Yeah.
[01:00:01] Speaker A: All right, man. As we're wrapping up, anything you want to say? Anything you want to shout out?
[01:00:05] Speaker B: No. Just, like, if you have the opportunity, come stop by the gym at dscombat sports. It's a. It's a beautiful place. It's like a great community, and I would be happy to see you all there.
[01:00:14] Speaker A: Yeah. Awesome. Well, thank you so much for your time.
[01:00:16] Speaker B: Thank you so much, sir. It's a pleasure.
[01:00:17] Speaker A: You bet. Everyone, this was. I hope you got as much out of this conversation as I did. I had a couple of moments where I was like, goddamn, that was the coolest.
You know, I am a firm believer that everything's competition, but that doesn't mean that everything's competition in a bad way. It means that the world is push and pull and growth and change, and being the best version of yourself usually means coming up against things that are going to create that and help that happen. So with that, you know, go through your day. Have a good one. My name's Ram. Marslanian. This is one step beyond.
[01:00:50] Speaker B: One step.
One step, one step beyond.
